Author Topic: Dodonpachi chaining: wtf?  (Read 2325 times)

Offline gsl

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Dodonpachi chaining: wtf?
« on: October 31, 2010, 04:50:16 PM »
Okay, so I fired up Dodonpachi last night to try and take part in the high score thread, and was immediately reminded of the most frustrating aspect of the game: the goddamn mysterious chaining.  I specifically have two questions:

1) What's the significance of the hit counter color?  Orange obviously means your counter is active, but what do blue, green, and yellow mean, aside from your chain is lost?  Do they provide any sort of information as to why the chain was lost?

2) Why are you totally boned when you use the laser?  I can have a good chain, laser a large enemy, and then completely lose my chain as I'm attempting to hit the popcorn enemy right next to it.  This happens whether I keep using the laser or switch to shot, and the time gap between the death of the large enemy and the small one is less than a second.  It seems like when you laser a large enemy, your chain meter drops to almost zero, and you're pretty much screwed if you ever have to break out the laser, period.  Help me understand how this works.  I imagine it's pretty similar in DOJ as well.

Offline spl

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Re: Dodonpachi chaining: wtf?
« Reply #1 on: October 31, 2010, 06:29:37 PM »
1. I'm not sure about this one. Don't think it matters too much but someone else will probably know.

2. When you use the laser on a large enemy - the chain meter is on almost zero yes and it dosen't get a spike once a large enemy is destroyed in the same way it jumps up a bit when you kill a popcorn enemy. Because of this when you kill a large enemy with the laser - you must immediately connect the laser with another enemy or the chain will break. You need to connect the laser with another popcorn or large enemy before you switch to shot. Most of the large enemies have got popcorn enemies all around them or other large things such as buildings etc which you can use.

You're not "boned when you use the laser" as you say - it's just that HOLDING the laser on targets holds your chain meter gauge at just above 0 so you must immediately connect the laser to something else as soon as it comes off whatever it's on currently. This is pretty easy once you figure out your chaining path. If you are just destroying popcorn enemies - because the laser isn't being HELD on an enemy - the chain meter gauge stays high with each hit.

DOJ is the same but hypers give you a bit more leeway I believe. Nothing mysterious about it at all.

Offline JOW

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Re: Dodonpachi chaining: wtf?
« Reply #2 on: October 31, 2010, 06:39:24 PM »
Why are you totally boned when you use the laser?  I can have a good chain, laser a large enemy, and then completely lose my chain as I'm attempting to hit the popcorn enemy right next to it.  This happens whether I keep using the laser or switch to shot, and the time gap between the death of the large enemy and the small one is less than a second.  It seems like when you laser a large enemy, your chain meter drops to almost zero, and you're pretty much screwed if you ever have to break out the laser, period.  Help me understand how this works.  I imagine it's pretty similar in DOJ as well.
I am by no means even slightly proficient at DDP but whenever I fire up DDP (or DOJ) I come across this precise issue. My first reaction is, "WTF, this laser is total arse", then I remember what game I am playing and that thousands cannot be wrong :-\

And I can appreciate that the start of DDP's level 2 is beatifully setup for sliding your laser from target to target but I've never had the patience to make a serious attempt at it - mainly because the laser / chain meter relationship seems so unintuitive to me.

To directly (attempt to) answer "Help me understand how this works", when lasering a large / medium sized enemy I try to line up a popcorn enemy so that I hit the popcorn just as (or just before) the larger dies - the chain meter will jump up as the popcorn is destroyed. Sounds easy but it often requires plenty of forward planning.

Bit of a layman's description that I hope is of some use.
 
EDIT: spl beat me to it!

Offline kernow

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Re: Dodonpachi chaining: wtf?
« Reply #3 on: October 31, 2010, 07:36:36 PM »
chaining is just no fun, I love the donpachi series but seriously, fuck chaining.

Offline spl

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Re: Dodonpachi chaining: wtf?
« Reply #4 on: October 31, 2010, 08:06:41 PM »
So many people seem to hate chaining and can't see the fun in developing your own chaining paths/patterns thru stages? It's really not too hard once you get used to it and the thrill of pulling off a perfect stage long chain is amazing. :P

Keep at it and watch some superplay videos to see how they alternate between the shot and laser. It will become second nature to you eventually. You will learn that laser use is crucial in order to get high chains and improve your scores.

Also - if you are using SHOT type ship - the laser engage time is a bit slower so maybe this is throwing you off too? Try a LASER type ship if you have not already. It seems you have troubles the other way around however - laser to shot, not shot to laser. Hope this helps.

Offline gsl

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Re: Dodonpachi chaining: wtf?
« Reply #5 on: October 31, 2010, 11:13:53 PM »
chaining is just no fun, I love the donpachi series but seriously, fuck chaining.
See, I don't mind chaining at all--it's a bit of a thrill, actually, when you figure out how to chain an area or connect a couple areas for the big points.  I just don't like not understanding the system, knowing that there's some sort of pattern or logic behind it but not having a goddamn clue.

@spl & JOW - Thanks for that; from your descriptions I think I understand my problem.  I use the LASER type ships, but generally only engage the laser on larger enemies or bosses.  When I'm preparing to move on from a large enemy, I immediately switch back to shot for the next popcorn guy instead of lasering him.  I didn't realize there was a difference, so I'll give it a try next time I play.

Offline moozooh

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Re: Dodonpachi chaining: wtf?
« Reply #6 on: November 01, 2010, 02:27:09 PM »
What's the significance of the hit counter color?  Orange obviously means your counter is active, but what do blue, green, and yellow mean, aside from your chain is lost?  Do they provide any sort of information as to why the chain was lost?

The chain is always lost to the depleted gauge or bombing/dying, you don't need additional information to figure that out. The color only tells you how large your chain was. If you're getting golden numbers most of the time it should indicate you're pretty good at chaining already.

Also keep in mind that the time for the fully charged chain gauge to deplete is 0.5 seconds.
<dan76> As it is I'll have to endure high res - life's hard.

Offline gsl

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Re: Dodonpachi chaining: wtf?
« Reply #7 on: November 02, 2010, 01:14:16 AM »
Quote from: moozooh
The chain is always lost to the depleted gauge or bombing/dying, you don't need additional information to figure that out.
Yeah, that was pretty obvious one of the first times I played the game.  What I asked pertains to the behavior of the gauge in the middle of a chain with certain enemies/shot types, not OMG WHY IZ CHAIN NOT THERE WEN I DIE?

Offline Fu-ZAN

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Re: Dodonpachi chaining: wtf?
« Reply #8 on: November 03, 2010, 06:59:15 AM »
Okay, so I fired up Dodonpachi last night to try and take part in the high score thread, and was immediately reminded of the most frustrating aspect of the game: the goddamn mysterious chaining.  I specifically have two questions:

1) What's the significance of the hit counter color?  Orange obviously means your counter is active, but what do blue, green, and yellow mean, aside from your chain is lost?  Do they provide any sort of information as to why the chain was lost?

2) Why are you totally boned when you use the laser?  I can have a good chain, laser a large enemy, and then completely lose my chain as I'm attempting to hit the popcorn enemy right next to it.  This happens whether I keep using the laser or switch to shot, and the time gap between the death of the large enemy and the small one is less than a second.  It seems like when you laser a large enemy, your chain meter drops to almost zero, and you're pretty much screwed if you ever have to break out the laser, period.  Help me understand how this works.  I imagine it's pretty similar in DOJ as well.

1) The color doesn't mean anything, it tells you approximately at what number you lost your chain. I don't remember exactly the numbers, but there is, for example (false numbers), yellow for 50-15, red for 100-51, green for 250-101... DDP is diferent from DOJ, as far as I remember you have more time switching to shot in DOJ.
2) Do not switch to shot after destroying an enemy as the time before actually shooting is like 1 second. If you keep your laser, you won't move as fast but you will still hit/destroy an enemy.