Author Topic: Deathsmiles [strats]  (Read 7027 times)

Offline gsl

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Deathsmiles [strats]
« on: February 29, 2008, 10:16:59 PM »
So I figured I'd start a strategy post for Deathsmiles, if people other than me are indeed still playing it after Futari Black Label came out. :laugh:

I'm getting to the point where I can clear the game pretty consistently, though not without wasting at least two lives (and all their bombs) on Tyrannosatan and cheating a bit by spamming him with the lock shot in order to slow down his shot patterns.  Anyone else do this, or am I just lame?

I normally play all stages on level 2 except for the road (because Mary's attacks are something fierce in level 3) and the swamp (to keep the suicide bullets away, though I'm going to have to chance it once I want to get a bit of a better score).  I'm missing out on one big scoring opportunity by never kicking off fever mode when I'm in the forest (saving my item counter for the volcano's scoring opportunity, which I always play after the forest), and when I get to the volcano I'm only ever able to pull out 35-40mil from the scoring trick, while I've seen videos online of players (usually using Casper, I play Rosa) pulling 50-60mil easily.  Any suggestions?

Offline EOJ

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« Reply #1 on: April 14, 2008, 01:42:49 AM »
I found a really nice Japanese strategy page:

http://www.bl.mmtr.or.jp/~miyaza/deathsmiles/d-main.html

Check out the individual stage strats - even if you can't read Japanese, you have to be impressed by all the detailed illustrations. That must have taken a lot of time. Reminds me of some of the great Japanese Ikaruga pages of old.

I'll be playing this game soon, and will be happy to chat strats with whoever is interested.
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Offline EOJ

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« Reply #2 on: April 21, 2008, 02:53:03 PM »
Okay, WTF, this game looks like the scoring system is simple, but it's actually really complicated.

Issues I'm dealing with:

-Different enemies need to be taken down with the shot, laser, or lock-on for maximum large skulls. If you use the wrong one, you get plain skulls. Here's a page showing which enemies to kill with what:

http://wiki00.jpn.org/deathsmiles/index.php?%E6%95%B5%E5%B1%9E%E6%80%A7%E4%B8%80%E8%A6%A7

Here's a similar chart made by a Japanese dude:
http://www48.tok2.com/home/stgup2/stgup2/src/stgup20039.gif

Also, it can change if you're in power-up mode, or in "fever mode" (when you're powered up and maxed at 10,000).
This takes a lot of skill, because you're constantly tapping A or B (for the shot), holding them briefly (for the laser), or holding one button and quickly pressing and holding the other (for the lock shot). There's a lot of finesse to the gameplay.

-In power-up mode, the counter goes down faster or slower apparently based on how fast (or slow?) you tap the shot, or how long you hold the laser. It's like Mushi all over again! I saw a Volcano vid w/ casper where the guy maintains the counter for almost the whole stage, whereas mine empties out around the mid point. :/

-Using the lock-shot in power-up mode is really difficult, because you need to weaken the enemy with the laser, and press the other button for the lock-shot at the last second. If you hold the lock-shot down too much, it really depletes your counter, so to make it worthwhile you have to master ninja timing.

-It's really hard to judge when and how to let the skulls bounce before collecting them. This takes a good deal of skill, and separates the high scores from the average ones.

-Try as I may, I still haven't been able to get the counter to jack back up to 1000 after power-up mode ends. I bomb in the same place as in the superplay vids, but I don't suck in all the skulls like they do. Still trying to figure out what I'm doing wrong.

The game is awesome, and I'm really pleased with the depth of the scoring system. I honestly didn't expect it to be so deep.
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Offline zlk

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Deathsmiles
« Reply #3 on: May 09, 2008, 01:15:52 PM »
Sorry if this information has been posted elsewhere:

How do you gain access to the two new characters?  Do you need to hold down P2 a+b+c while you input the P1 commands?  Can you gain access to the new characters in free play mode?

Offline EOJ

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« Reply #4 on: May 09, 2008, 01:50:14 PM »
Here are the codes:

FOLLETT:
2P: Hold A, B +C
1P: ↑, ↑, ↑, ↑, B,B,A,A, ←, ←, →, →, C, C, C, ↓, C

ROSA:
2P: Hold A, B, +C
1P: C,B,A,C,B,↑,A,→,C,←,B,↓,C,B,A,A,A

UNLOCK CANYON STAGE:
2P: Hold A, B, +C
1P: C,C,C,A,↑,←,→,↓,B,C,C,C,↓,↓,A,B,C,B,A


So yes, you have to hold AB+C on the 2P while you input the 1P code. I didn't try it on Freeplay, so I don't know if it works. You probably need to turn freeplay off though, to have enough time to input the code. I just put in a credit, then did the codes at the title screen and they worked. You hear the character's voice after you successfully input their code.
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Offline cannonball

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« Reply #5 on: May 15, 2008, 09:36:18 AM »
Do you have to enter the codes for characters and canyon every time you play or can they be unlocked once like with manpuku/harahara in MMP?

Offline Sperrfeuer

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« Reply #6 on: May 15, 2008, 09:47:54 AM »
no only 1X, and it will be saved

Offline cannonball

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« Reply #7 on: May 25, 2008, 01:12:51 AM »
Can anyone explain in depth how to control the speed of the counter in fever mode?  I figure I need to hit the mid point of C-2 with around 400 left in order to bomb at the point where the rocks come out of the center boulder at 4 angles.

I always seem to be at around 350 or less and I end up sucking in barely anything to get my counter back up.

Offline EOJ

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« Reply #8 on: May 25, 2008, 04:23:57 AM »
Apparently you have to tap the button slowly in rhythm (like Mushi's slow A tapping) to slow down the counter. It actually creates slowdown if you time it right, and you need to manipulate this slowdown to score well. If you hold down your laser, the counter goes down rapidly - if you hold down the lock-shot it goes down even faster.

Thus, people who don't like Mushi-style tapping won't like this game either.

I can't get that bomb trick to work at all. From what I gather you have to tap the shot after a bomb right as the counter reaches 1 to hit the enemies and change them to large crowns. Really hard to get the timing right.
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Offline cannonball

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« Reply #9 on: May 25, 2008, 10:56:50 AM »
Alright slow rhythmic tapping.  I'll give that a try.  I had been holding down laser on the first big scoring spot in C-2 and then tapping the second before the bomb spot so that's probably why I never had enough left on the counter.

I actually got that bomb trick to work once, well at least somewhat, I managed to turn everything to orange crowns but only sucked in about 680 points worth.  Not sure what I did differently that run, but I know I triggered the bomb with around 400 left on the counter.  It seems like it doesn't hit the green flying guys moving up the screen until near the end of the bomb animation.  I had positioned myself down near where the rocks are coming out.  I didn't use shot at all during the bombing.  If you're watching that 500 mil rosa run it's hard to tell what he's doing at that point.  Almost looks like he has lock shot activated.

As for the other bombing trick spots, I've had no luck same as you.  And my scoring is suffering lol.  I think my best run now is 122mil since I'm always building my counter back up from 0.

edit:

I just rewatched that spot a few times on superplay and he does go into lock shot with his option up near the "green flying guys" just as his counter is ending.

Offline cannonball

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« Reply #10 on: May 25, 2008, 07:31:14 PM »
Yeah EOJ.  Position your option near the green guys in c-2, bomb and go right into lock shot.  I'm able to get it back to 1000 every time now with that method.

AlephNull

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« Reply #11 on: May 26, 2008, 03:12:46 AM »
Hello. Sorry for reposting this question, which I just posted on shmups.com, but this looks like the more active thread.

How do you trigger the cake item after beating Jitterbug?

Also, are there any Japanese sites with well-summarized strategies/discussion for Deathsmiles? Currently I'm mainly using b-board and niconico vids for reference. The Deathsmiles wiki doesn't seem to have much, and the 2ch threads are difficult for me to read (besides the first posts).


EDIT: I just looked at the first link EOJ posted here. Oh, wow! That is just... amazing!

Offline EOJ

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« Reply #12 on: May 26, 2008, 03:24:37 AM »
Quote from: AlephNull
How do you trigger the cake item after beating Jitterbug?
If you don't bomb during the Jitterbug fight, you get the cake (worth 2 life blocks) after he dies.
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AlephNull

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« Reply #13 on: May 26, 2008, 09:26:16 AM »
Thanks. Didn't manage to pull that off today, looks like I need more practice.

Cannonball, for the bomb trick, do you have to enter lock mode at the 'right' time, or just any time before the bomb destroys everything on screen? I tried going into lock mode right after bombing today, once immediately after I released the bomb, the other time with a slight delay (was a mistake actually). Failed both times.

Offline cannonball

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« Reply #14 on: May 26, 2008, 10:57:47 AM »
I'm bombing and then going into lock shot as quickly as possible.  You want to kill as many things with lock before bomb ends as possible.  It's definitely a timing thing though.  It took a hand full of attempts to figure out that perfect location and time to do it.  I can't believe how perfect some of the timing in this game has to be.  I still can't pull off the second bomb spot in C-2.

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« Reply #15 on: May 26, 2008, 01:35:21 PM »
Eh? Meaning the gold crowns are supposed to be generated from the lock shot kills, rather than the bomb kills? If so, that probably explains my failure. (I think I just entered lock shot mode without targeting anything)

But looking at the Rosa 500mil vid, the green eyeballs are destroyed by the bomb, not the lock shot, then lots of gold crowns appear.

Offline cannonball

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« Reply #16 on: May 26, 2008, 07:16:33 PM »
Quote from: AlephNull
Eh? Meaning the gold crowns are supposed to be generated from the lock shot kills, rather than the bomb kills? If so, that probably explains my failure. (I think I just entered lock shot mode without targeting anything)

But looking at the Rosa 500mil vid, the green eyeballs are destroyed by the bomb, not the lock shot, then lots of gold crowns appear.
That's the vid I'm trying to mimic and every time I did it without lock shot I rarely got any orange crowns, and with lock shot I'm getting tons.  It's hard to tell what he's targeting in the vid with the lock shot but he uses it also.  Most of the green eyeballs are still getting killed by the bomb I think, but the ones the lock hits (or the large boulders) are generating a lot.  It's hard to tell why lock shot is working so well.

Offline EOJ

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« Reply #17 on: May 26, 2008, 10:46:41 PM »
It's not surprising the lock-shot produces a ton of crowns from the green eyeballs. They are an enemy that you need to kill with the shot up to 10,000 on the counter, but once you hit 10,000 you need to use the lock-shot to get maximum crowns from them.
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AlephNull

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« Reply #18 on: May 27, 2008, 04:13:55 AM »
I don't think you have to use the lock shot to kill during the bomb to generate the gold, though that is one way. (Note that this is from vid watching, not actually tested yet.)

Let's look at three bomb spots from the Rosa vid.

1) The second bomb in C-2 (volcano) illustrates the use of lock shot for gold generation. Note that the pigs are killed after the bomb is released, but before the bomb blast hits them. Lock shot is the one that generates the most gold from pigs (in all situations), so what's happening here is that the gold is indeed generated by the lock shot, not the bomb. The bomb is simply to reduce the counter in time to allow the player to collect the gold outside of power-up mode.

2) The last bomb in B-1 (forest). The player clearly goes into lock shot after releasing the bomb, but the lock is targeted behind Rosa, not at the green ivys in front. So you don't have to actually kill anything with the lock shot to `trigger' a gold generating bomb effect or anything like that. The bomb simply kills while the player is in lock shot mode. This was done with a counter of <400. I imagine that if you reach this spot with a much lower counter (say ~100), then the method of killing with the lock shot then using the bomb to reduce the counter quickly as per 1) would apply instead.

3) The first bomb in C-2. Yeah, hard to tell if the lock shot is actually firing at anything or if it's even engaged at all. But note that the player bombs with a counter of ~400, so it would be difficult to time boulder kills and collection of (hypothetical) gold crowns from them. In fact, large boulders are supposed to be killed with lazer (in all situations), not lock. You only see skulls coming from below the player (presumably produced by the familiar's roses passing through them), not gold crowns. The gold crowns come from the eyeballs, this should be the where the bulk of the counter value comes from. Going by 2), and as per EOJ's comment above, I think the point is just to destroy the green eyeballs while you're in lock shot mode, regardless of whether you're actually targeting anything.


To sum up, gold generation is probably dependent just on what mode the player is in when they are killed, rather that what shot/bomb kills them. I think this holds outside of the bomb related stuff as well, e.g. in C-1 (trains), there are places where the player releases a stream of roses through the ogre trains and tanks, but switches to lock shot mode without targeting anything just before they are destroyed, i.e. they are killed by the roses. Note that lock shot produces the most gold from them in power-up/fever mode.

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« Reply #19 on: May 27, 2008, 04:18:38 AM »
Btw are there good Folette vids available? (say featuring a similar level of route planning as ロザ三十七さい). Most vids seem to be for Roza. I play Folette, and I imagine pathing for here should be very different that for the other characters, because of the close-range nature of her lazer. I'm finding it hard to move away after gold generation (to let the crowns split up), wonder how other people do it.

Offline cannonball

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« Reply #20 on: May 27, 2008, 01:38:38 PM »
Quote from: AlephNull
I don't think you have to use the lock shot to kill during the bomb to generate the gold, though that is one way. (Note that this is from vid watching, not actually tested yet.)
Every time I've tested it being in lock-shot mode produced many more gold crowns (whether it was from kills or bomb).  If the bomb acts the same as other weapons, it would definitely generate more gold crowns if you're in lock-shot mode at the time the bomb kills the enemy.

Quote
To sum up, gold generation is probably dependent just on what mode the player is in when they are killed, rather that what shot/bomb kills them.
This is true throughout the game in or out of fever mode.  For example I usually go into laser to fire off roses, then switch to lock-shot to generate more crowns and orange crowns from certain enemies as the roses kill them.  It all comes down to what mode you're in when the enemy dies.  

Realizing that the bomb acts the same way explains a lot.

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« Reply #21 on: May 29, 2008, 04:45:17 PM »
Earlier I said that the Deathsmiles wiki (Japanese) doesn't seem to have much info. My bad, it actually has a lot. It answers a lot of the above questions. In particular, regarding slowdown during power-up mode, the counter decreases at different rates depending on what shot is being used.

No shots being fired: -0.5 per frame
Normal shot (tap A): -0.5 to 1 / f
Lazer: 1 / f
Lock shot: 2 / f

Also, if you go into lock mode without targeting anything, apparently the counter will decrease more slowly than if you target something (I couldn't find exact figures). So the key to preserving counter is just to fire only when necessary. The rhythmic tap A 'trick' may just be a method of moderating the use of normal shot.



Regarding the superplay DVD, does anyone know if the plays are with minimal use of power-up mode (i.e. maintaining a 10k bonus throughout most of the game and eating bullets for score) or with regular use of power-up mode? (or different for different characters?)

Offline rtw

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« Reply #22 on: June 03, 2008, 09:55:15 AM »
Finally got my hands on this little gem :D

However I have a few questions regarding the basic game play.

Are the following definitions correct ?

shot - tapping A
laser - holding A
lock-on - holding A+B

Does your counter power up faster if you allow enemy bullets to scratch your aura ?

What is meant by power-up mode ? (Is this when the counter is counting up to  1000)

What is meant by fever mode ?

It looks as if there are no counter penalties when using the bomb. Is this correct ?

What happens to the objects the enemies drop when you bomb ?

rtw
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Offline cannonball

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« Reply #23 on: June 03, 2008, 10:10:42 AM »
Quote from: rtw
Finally got my hands on this little gem :D
Are the following definitions correct ?

shot - tapping A
laser - holding A
lock-on - holding A+B
Pretty much.  In laser mode, simply start holding down the opposite fire button to go into lock-on mode.

Quote
Does your counter power up faster if you allow enemy bullets to scratch your aura ?
No.  The counter powers up only based on the types of skulls or crowns collected.

Quote
What is meant by fever mode ?
This is when your counter is at 1000 and you press A+B.  You will go into fever mode and your counter will start to decrease down to zero.  During this time enemies give many more items and your point counter can reach 10000.

NOTE: If you never go into fever mode your point counter can also reach 10000, but it will take a very long time.  This technique is used in the later stages with suicide bullets.

Quote
It looks as if there are no counter penalties when using the bomb. Is this correct ?
This is correct, but if you're in fever mode, the bomb makes your counter drain extremely quickly down to zero, ending fever mode.  This is done intentionally a lot so you can quickly end fever mode and collect a lot of orange crowns to quickly refill your counter to 1000 to go into fever mode again.

Quote
What happens to the objects the enemies drop when you bomb ?
The objects are treated the same as when not bombing.  They're always added to your counter if not in fever more, or to your score/point counter if in fever mode.

Offline rtw

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« Reply #24 on: June 04, 2008, 06:10:58 AM »
cannonball, thank you for your detailed answer :D

Quote from: cannonball
This is when your counter is at 1000 and you press A+B.  You will go into fever mode and your counter will start to decrease down to zero.  During this time enemies give many more items and your point counter can reach 10000.
What is this point counter and where can it be seen ? What are the strategies for increasing it ?

rtw
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Offline cannonball

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« Reply #25 on: June 04, 2008, 12:25:04 PM »
Quote from: rtw
cannonball, thank you for your detailed answer :D

Quote from: cannonball
This is when your counter is at 1000 and you press A+B.  You will go into fever mode and your counter will start to decrease down to zero.  During this time enemies give many more items and your point counter can reach 10000.
What is this point counter and where can it be seen ? What are the strategies for increasing it ?

rtw
When your normal counter reaches 1000, your point counter begins at 0 and goes to 10000.  Your point counter increases based on the types of items collected.  You can see your current point counter whenever you pick up items during these conditions at the location of the item collected.  Once fever mode ends or your counter is reduced from 1000 during normal play, your point counter is reset to 0.


One good technique (depending on your stage order), is to have your counter at 1000 going into the boss fight, then begin fever mode just before you kill the boss.  All items given by the boss dying are added to your point counter (and your normal counter freezes until the next stage begins).

Also, whenever you go into fever mode, all bullets on the screen turn into orange crowns.  This is a great opportunity to get a good start on your counter by entering fever mode with lots of bullets on screen.

Other than that, you want to kill enemies in fever mode the way that generates the most skulls/crowns/etc.  Once you reach 10000 on the point counter you can let everything break down into skulls for maximum points.

Check the rosa 500mil video for some examples.  It's very helpful.

Offline rtw

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« Reply #26 on: June 04, 2008, 01:11:22 PM »
cannonball, thank you again for your detailed answer :D

one last question, my PCB had canyon enabled by default. I was playing a few levels
just now and after jumping between difficulty 2 - 3 I could still select the Canyon. I though
the Canyon was only accessable if you did all levels on difficulty 3 ?

I will check out the video, thanks for the tip.

rtw
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Offline cannonball

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« Reply #27 on: June 04, 2008, 02:10:00 PM »
Yeah I thought so too,  but I can also access canyon it seems no matter what ranks I play on, although canyon is always played on the highest rank no matter what.  Not sure what the requirements are.

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« Reply #28 on: June 05, 2008, 06:41:43 AM »
Just wanted to clarify this:

Quote from: rtw
What is meant by power-up mode ? (Is this when the counter is counting up to  1000)

What is meant by fever mode ?
When your normal counter reaches 1000 and you press A+B, you enter power-up (パワーアップ) mode. (this is what cannonball referred to earlier as fever mode). During power-up mode, once your point counter reaches 10000, you enter fever (フィーバー) mode. You exit power-up or fever mode once your normal counter stops flashing (either when it decreases to 0, or you lose a bar of health).

There are differences to the two modes besides just the name. For some enemies, the shot type that produces the best/most crowns changes depending on what mode you're in. Take a look at this table. It's in Japanese, here's what some of the headers mean:

- The pictures show the enemy in question.

- The coloured bars show which shot produces the most white crowns when not in power-up or fever mode.
  - enemies under the grey bar produce no crowns at all (なし)
  - enemies under the blue bar produce the most white crowns when you kill them while you're firing shots (ショット)
  - enemies under the red bar produce the most when killed while you're firing the lazer (レーザー)
  - enemies under the green bar produce the most when killed while you're in lock mode (ロック)

- Under each enemy, the first entry shows the number of white crowns produced by the best shot outside of
power-up or fever mode.
- a green ロック in the second entry means the best shot for that enemy changes to lock during power-up mode
- a green ロック in the third entry means lock is the best shot during fever mode

Note that you don't necessarily have to kill the enemy with the best shot to get max crowns, you only need to be in that firing mode at that point in time; it can be any shot that actually kills the enemy.

Offline cannonball

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« Reply #29 on: June 05, 2008, 11:28:32 AM »
Quote from: AlephNull
Just wanted to clarify this:

There are differences to the two modes besides just the name. For some enemies, the shot type that produces the best/most crowns changes depending on what mode you're in.
Ah nice I didn't realize there was a difference in what weapon to use before and after hitting 10000.  Thanks for the clarification.