Author Topic: Pink Sweets [Strategy guide]  (Read 23884 times)

Offline EOJ

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Re: Pink Sweets [Strategy guide]
« Reply #180 on: April 25, 2019, 02:54:18 AM »
Thanks for the tips! I'll have to practice the last boss some more. Also that link on Archer's site is great for the rank info.  :righton:
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Offline Monouchi

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Re: Pink Sweets [Strategy guide]
« Reply #181 on: April 25, 2019, 03:26:36 AM »
With Special you mean that beta version on Mame? Rank behaves the same there. I think this was debunked some time ago.

Power ups and charged RC are both not too bad for rank. Check out this link for some exact numbers: http://archerstg.web.fc2.com/pinksweets/bitterrank.htm

What's your approach to the non inf lives clear? Do you plan to max out the rank eventually? If yes, then don't worry about it at all and let it max out around stage 4 or 5. If you want to go low rank non inf lives, then try to copy the routes you find on youtube (plenty of videos available), which in short means: don't pick up anything at all.

It was more about activating the special ver. (Dip switch 2 and the hold A+B to start vs not starting the special ver.)
Not sure what he means.

I do study that page but when going full power up and having the RC fully charged I get max rank sooner in my route.
In my route (Non inf live clear) I max out at st6 boss. If I max out earlier the cone assault at end of stage 6 is impossible.
I pick up one spread shot and then get homing RH in stage 4, yesterday I reached st7 midboss with 4 lives. (And then I missed the easy 1up in st7 tank....)
So getting closer.

Trying now to optimize my route so I get a second item extend at start of st7.
Just noticed that absorbing bullets with the charged RC increases the -counter for item extend. (That is subtracted from the + counter.)

Offline Plasmo

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Re: Pink Sweets [Strategy guide]
« Reply #182 on: April 25, 2019, 04:17:50 AM »
Quote
Just noticed that absorbing bullets with the charged RC increases the -counter for item extend. (That is subtracted from the + counter.)

Where did you get that info from? I highly doubt that this is the case.

Offline Monouchi

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Re: Pink Sweets [Strategy guide]
« Reply #183 on: April 25, 2019, 04:37:37 AM »
Quote
Just noticed that absorbing bullets with the charged RC increases the -counter for item extend. (That is subtracted from the + counter.)

Where did you get that info from? I highly doubt that this is the case.

Its from the shmups PS secrets thread:
https://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=43152

"in 1UP item release involved two counters:
- number of enemies killed by Main Shot (shown on screenshot in 1st post)
- number of enemies killed by Rose Cracker (shown below of ^^^)
then (Main_Shot_kills - Rose_Cracker_kills) becomes bigger than specific constant, which is 2500 in 2006/04/06 versions and 3000 in XX/XX version - next spawned item will be 1UP.
so, if player used Rose Cracker a lot and killed a many enemies using it - he will get 1UP much later, if ever."


This counter can be found above the item counter in the debug menu and it increases when absorbing bullets with your charged RC and when your RC destroys bullets. (Counter does not increase when RC does not hit anything.)

I wondered why I didnt get my second item-extend, even when I milked st4 boss and used almost no RC on stage 5 boss and then milked st6 boss.
I checked the counters and I clearly passed 2500 (9C4)...though I had also used the RC heavily in st5 and st6 and that counter was also high.

Will do some more tests.


Offline Plasmo

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Re: Pink Sweets [Strategy guide]
« Reply #184 on: April 25, 2019, 04:44:11 AM »
It's probably a mistake or at least not present in the regular version of PS. Absorbing regular bullets with the aura of your RC is totally fine. Otherwise I would never get the extend after fully absorbing the timeout patterns of st4 and st5 midbosses.

I have never read about this anywhere in the Japanese strategy guides as well (Arcadia mag or online).

Offline Monouchi

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Re: Pink Sweets [Strategy guide]
« Reply #185 on: April 25, 2019, 04:55:08 AM »
What do you refer to as Regular ver?  :)
Im testing this in the four dot ver in Mame, will check this at home too on the pcb.

Im not so sure that only the +item counter gives you the 1up, Ive passed 2500 but dont get my second item-extend.

Offline Plasmo

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Re: Pink Sweets [Strategy guide]
« Reply #186 on: April 25, 2019, 06:12:32 AM »
It's easier to conceptualize as is stated in the main post. Even if there are two counters internally, simply view it as one counter that goes +1 for every enemy/bullet destroyed with Shot and goes -1 for every enemy/bullet destroyed with your RC. Once that counter reaches 2500, a 1UP pops up.

Offline EOJ

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Re: Pink Sweets [Strategy guide]
« Reply #187 on: April 25, 2019, 03:01:33 PM »
The four dot revision apparently has a slower rank increase compared to the other 2006/04/06 versions. That's what it says on the Arcadeotaku wiki anyway. (I did not notice this when I owned it, but if someone tested the rates of rank increase and compared them across versions, then I cannot argue with that.) It may have other changes as well.

I don't know if this affects the 1UP appearance rate other than lower rank = fewer destructible bullets = longer wait for 1UP to appear, but it is something worth considering.

Anyway, I wouldn't practice on that version in MAME.

Plasmo is correct about everything else discussed in regard to the normal 2006/04/06 one dot master ver.

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Offline Monouchi

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Re: Pink Sweets [Strategy guide]
« Reply #188 on: April 25, 2019, 09:19:32 PM »
It's easier to conceptualize as is stated in the main post. Even if there are two counters internally, simply view it as one counter that goes +1 for every enemy/bullet destroyed with Shot and goes -1 for every enemy/bullet destroyed with your RC. Once that counter reaches 2500, a 1UP pops up.

Maybe so, but I am interested in the actual numbers. (Its also kinda what I work with daily.)
Also confirmed on the one dot version that the - counter increases when absorbing shots.
Now to test if the 1up is set when the 2500 value is passed or if it needs to be active when getting the 1up pick-up. (Not passed with the -counter.)


EOJ:
I also red about the slower rank increase on AO, we debunked that earlier with the RC, I can test some more in the one dot version and see how the rank behaves on other parts.

Offline EOJ

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Re: Pink Sweets [Strategy guide]
« Reply #189 on: April 25, 2019, 09:27:46 PM »
I'm not very sure about this "-counter", but absorbing bullets with the RC has no effect on the +counter, unlike killing enemies/destructible bullets with the RC, so it is not of any importance for 1UP appearance.
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Offline Monouchi

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Re: Pink Sweets [Strategy guide]
« Reply #190 on: April 25, 2019, 09:36:41 PM »
I'm not very sure about this "-counter", but absorbing bullets with the RC has no effect on the +counter, unlike killing enemies/destructible bullets with the RC, so it is not of any importance for 1UP appearance.

No, the +counter only increases with killed enemies/shots, though it doesnt Decrease (Just not affected) when killing enemies/shots with the RC. (That is added to the - counter above, though the RC fired is also added to some other counter below the + counter. Absorbing bullets is not added to that one)
Just tested it in the one dot ver.

Offline EOJ

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Re: Pink Sweets [Strategy guide]
« Reply #191 on: April 25, 2019, 09:39:21 PM »

No, the +counter only increases with killed enemies/shots, though it doesnt Decrease (Just not affected) when killing enemies/shots with the RC. (That is added to the - counter above, though the RC fired is also added to some other counter below the + counter. Absorbing bullets is not added to that one)
Just tested it in the one dot ver.

Well then perhaps you need to focus on that "some other counter" instead of this so-called "-counter", because, as stated many times, absorbing bullets with the RC does not affect the 1UP appearance at all.

Case in point: if I use rapid B from the start of Stage 1, I can get the first 1UP to pop out in the first half of stage 2, after milking many rounds of bullets on the boss with my RC. I think that would be impossible if the RC absorbing normal bullets did anything to 1UP the counters.
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Offline Monouchi

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Re: Pink Sweets [Strategy guide]
« Reply #192 on: April 25, 2019, 09:47:30 PM »
Ok, thanks, I wont bother with more questions.
And it would be stupid of me to not practice on the same ver as my pcb.

Cheers.

Offline EOJ

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Re: Pink Sweets [Strategy guide]
« Reply #193 on: April 25, 2019, 10:25:46 PM »
I don't want to discourage you from asking more questions on this or other topics, but I am very skeptical in this case because it is contrary to what CAVE, Arcadia, and hackers of the game have stated. It also seems contrary to what I have experienced in the game, though I have not tracked the numerical values during play (and I have been wrong about other aspects of this game before, as documented in this thread). However, if you can present a strong case for normal bullets absorbed by the charged RC actually affecting the 1UP appearance rate in some way, that would be a significant discovery and I encourage you to share your data.  :righton:
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