Author Topic: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]  (Read 12701 times)

Offline ookitarepanda

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #30 on: January 19, 2010, 12:56:35 PM »
What does the legal screen start with? It'd be odd to have it say "INTERNATIONAL BL" but still say "For use in JAPAN only."

Offline pixeljunkie

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #31 on: January 20, 2010, 03:24:10 PM »
What does the legal screen start with? It'd be odd to have it say "INTERNATIONAL BL" but still say "For use in JAPAN only."

I'll snap a pic, but its like "legal for use within import/export laws, blah blah" It is revised/different text though

Offline HUU

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #32 on: January 21, 2010, 02:33:36 PM »
It's not at shinjuku taito station so I doubt anywhere else has it.  Hey is possible though.  Kaneda or HUU?
I'm not in Tokyo at the moment ... but was there very recently and never noticed such a revision at Hey !
I think if Cave made some changes on the MFBL game itself, they would have say so in their blog or website ...
IMO this should be the same game.
As it looks like an international version, this is may be just an "another version" for legal issues or something like that ... I don't know ..
It would be cool to post a full pic of the disclaimer and may be test menu ...

Offline brentsg

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #33 on: January 29, 2010, 03:00:15 AM »
I talked to Fannie a bit tonight on IM and got the following when I inquired about the "international another version" Black Label Futari kit: 

"they change the ep rom only the mushihime futari to Mushihime Futari black label"



Now, this could easily be translation issues..  but I wonder if these "another version" Black Label PCBs were reprogrammed Futari 1.5 boards.. 

Offline emphatic

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #34 on: January 29, 2010, 11:35:43 AM »
I talked to Fannie a bit tonight on IM and got the following when I inquired about the "international another version" Black Label Futari kit: 

"they change the ep rom only the mushihime futari to Mushihime Futari black label"



Now, this could easily be translation issues..  but I wonder if these "another version" Black Label PCBs were reprogrammed Futari 1.5 boards.. 

I wonder how different the hardware is on 1.5 and Futari. Perhaps they just made a tiny change on the PCB at first to prevent people from upgrading 1.5->BL themselves (on day of release) with leaked roms, then changed the program on the eprom later so that they can easily turn a 1.5->BL themselves. Shouldn't be that easy though, right?

Offline EOJ

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #35 on: January 29, 2010, 01:35:09 PM »
I wonder how different the hardware is on 1.5 and Futari.

It's exactly the same.
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Offline brentsg

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #36 on: February 09, 2010, 01:59:18 PM »
It looks like they started new serial numbers for these.  So anyways they should be easy to spot in the wild..  between this and the new box (no AMI logo).

The sticker is:  MFBA - 700xx...

Offline ookitarepanda

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #37 on: March 15, 2011, 01:48:59 AM »
New info!!

My friend Alex just bought this kit from HK Legend recently in his search for a Mushi 2 BL board. What we found was remarkable. First, here are the bootup pictures we took today:







Anyway, when I played, I noticed that bosses went down faster than I was used to. I have had a LOT of time with the regular BL thanks to a loan a while ago, and have also played it plenty on the port. I would say I'm really familiar with the game at this point. So we gathered up some evidence and tried an experiment.

The following are four videos: one of each stage's boss for stages 1-4. We tried to do as little bombing as possible, and use only the laser (just for control on the experiment). Compare these with your experience with Mushi Futari Black Label. The bosses DEFINITELY have lower defense or HP.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HXk3FNu9dk0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHNT-AmG49I
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hdwla2Fw9ww
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q6fJmLJEov8

Specifically look for: dragon doesn't get to jump during first bracket when he normally completes a jump, squid's second bracket ends before the bad part of his second pattern starts going, spider's final form ends fast, beetle's first form goes down before the fourth ring comes down.

Other than that, all the midbosses have the same health, the bullet speeds/patterns are all the same, and the rest of the system is in order. The HP of the bosses is also the same between Original, Maniac, and God on this version, so they all have the lowered HP. I should also note that YES, this is on normal rank, default lives, default extend scores, default everything.

Weigh in! Let me know what you think. Hopefully I rounded up some helpful info for you guys this time around...
« Last Edit: March 15, 2011, 02:21:22 AM by ookitarepanda »

Offline EOJ

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #38 on: March 15, 2011, 02:23:13 AM »
Wow, thanks a lot. I'll link to it on the front page.

But seriously, what's the deal, Cave? This makes "Another Ver" scores unacceptable in the Futari BL rankings. Looks like a dumb "let's make it easy for the scrub foreigners" tweak.  :whyioughtta:
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Offline brentsg

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #39 on: March 15, 2011, 03:21:56 AM »
You should check to see if difficulty settings restore the HP.  I've got an "another ver" PCB but Ive never played the other.  I had noticed the bosses went down more quickly than 1.5 but thought it was simply a BL thing.

I'll compare to the port.

I honestly don't understand why they would tweak difficulty.  These were on the shelf in HK, and were returned, flashed, and sent back to vendors.  Why would they do this?

I've been very curious about this version since it was released.  I know that some of the Cave folks are fairly accessible via Twitter, blogs, festivals, etc.  If anyone can coax the official story behind this version from IKD (or any other credible Cave resource), they will receive a free Akai Katana SE for Xbox when it's released.
« Last Edit: March 15, 2011, 03:52:26 AM by brentsg »

Offline skykid

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #40 on: March 15, 2011, 08:49:12 AM »
If anyone can coax the official story behind this version from IKD (or any other credible Cave resource), they will receive a free Akai Katana SE for Xbox when it's released.

That's a nice offer, but isn't the story behind it self-explanitory? It just a one-off idea to release MFBL internationally, with the difficulty downgraded even further to compensate for the poor hand to eye coordination us westerners are regrettably born with.
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Offline ookitarepanda

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #41 on: March 15, 2011, 11:53:13 AM »
I sent a DM to caveworld, since they've responded to me before. Last time I talked to them though, Masa-KING wouldn't autograph a picture of Sergeant Wing for me. What a jerk. He said "then everyone would want one!"  :mad:

We'll see what's up with this. For now, my friend has his board so I won't have access to it to take more pictures or do more video for a little bit. I'll let you guys know if I find out any more.

BEFORE I FORGET: I should mention that nothing extra is in English. The endings are all still in Japanese, so it's not like it's really an "international" version.

Offline skykid

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #42 on: March 15, 2011, 11:57:26 AM »
BEFORE I FORGET: I should mention that nothing extra is in English. The endings are all still in Japanese, so it's not like it's really an "international" version.

Oh, that's weird. In that case I have no idea what they were thinking. A game specified as for use in "all countries except Japan", yet is all in Japanese.

Oh Cave.  :facepalm:
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Offline brentsg

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #43 on: March 15, 2011, 11:58:29 AM »
If anyone can coax the official story behind this version from IKD (or any other credible Cave resource), they will receive a free Akai Katana SE for Xbox when it's released.

That's a nice offer, but isn't the story behind it self-explanitory? It just a one-off idea to release MFBL internationally, with the difficulty downgraded even further to compensate for the poor hand to eye coordination us westerners are regrettably born with.


I think it's easy enough to spin stories around what facts we have, but we've already done that once and we were wrong.

There are still things that make no sense.  I believe only 1, maybe 2 vendors had any stock of this game at the time.  They were returned to Cave for mysterious reasons, then returned after some tweak in a new (non-AMI) box with the exact same art.  The vendors didn't seem clear exactly what was taking place.  There was little to no quantity before or after the changes were made.  There was no "International Release", no advertising/promotion, no mention on a Cave blog.  It was like a stealth move using already existing stock.  On top of all this, there is likely a negligible number of these kits.

None of that makes any sense.  Why would Cave waste any time on this?

Offline Terramax

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #44 on: March 15, 2011, 12:14:26 PM »
Personally, I don't see what the fuss is about for being easier. This version isn't targetted at people like us. If we were ever going to play Futari we would've done so ages ago.

This game has been specifically tailored for people used to playing Dance Revolution, Mario Kart arcade and typical lightgun games. If they lost all their lives within the first 30 seconds of play, they'd never play another game again. On the other hand, make the game more welcoming for newcomers and we may see more dipping their toes in the water and importing other Cave shooters, which can only be a good thing for Cave and our community, right?

Offline HVL

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #45 on: March 15, 2011, 12:35:48 PM »
Personally, I don't see what the fuss is about for being easier. This version isn't targetted at people like us. If we were ever going to play Futari we would've done so ages ago.

This game has been specifically tailored for people used to playing Dance Revolution, Mario Kart arcade and typical lightgun games. If they lost all their lives within the first 30 seconds of play, they'd never play another game again. On the other hand, make the game more welcoming for newcomers and we may see more dipping their toes in the water and importing other Cave shooters, which can only be a good thing for Cave and our community, right?

You know, they could've modified the settings the game defaults to. That way, casuals and more seasoned fans would both be happy. That actually would've been a sensible way of doing it.

Offline ookitarepanda

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #46 on: March 15, 2011, 12:46:36 PM »
You know, they could've modified the settings the game defaults to. That way, casuals and more seasoned fans would both be happy. That actually would've been a sensible way of doing it.

After the couple comments about this, I'll have to ask my friend to check what level 3 difficulty is. The only reason why I'm skeptical that this would be a solution is because it seems to be ONLY the bosses that have any change from the regular black label game, and I would think that difficulty would affect all bullet pattern density, bullet speed, and enemy HP.

Offline brentsg

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #47 on: March 15, 2011, 12:59:58 PM »
Personally, I don't see what the fuss is about for being easier. This version isn't targetted at people like us. If we were ever going to play Futari we would've done so ages ago.

Well I don't think it's a fuss in the sense that people are offended, just that it's a curiosity.  At least that's how it is for me.  I bought it largely for this reason, knowing there might be differences.  I just never put time into the port to make a comparison.

And it's not like they rolled this out and it was stocked and sold by Western vendors or distributors.  As far as I know it was sold by HK Legend and possibly Excellent (I don't recall and haven't reviewed the thread).  So I don't really think it was aimed at the West.

I also suspect that it was a simple tweak to the defaults and the normal version may be playable.  I'm 1 RGB cable short of being able to put my Xbox in one of my cabs, then I'll give the port a good workout and compare.

Offline ookitarepanda

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #48 on: March 15, 2011, 01:52:01 PM »
Already ahead of you. Here are the videos I just took of the 360 port (arcade mode) bosses of stage 1, 2, and 4. We already know there's a big discrepancy between the stage 3 boss on the port and on the original board, so I omitted that. Also, pardon my dying, I was just trying to prove a point that if you let those extra seconds go, you'll either die or bomb and your score will go WAY down.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PKz3cb5J2U
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JfHn_HiDzgA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QGEHVSJNGwo

If anyone has the regular BL board, I would love to see a video done in the same way. Just laser the entire time with Reco, default power-ups.

Offline bitkid

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #49 on: March 15, 2011, 02:11:50 PM »
So far you guys have shown Original mode bosses. Are the bosses or stages any different in Maniac or God?

Offline ookitarepanda

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #50 on: March 15, 2011, 02:31:02 PM »
I mentioned briefly in my post that Maniac and God have the bosses' health lower as well. Nothing else has changed about those modes, though. If I get a chance to play around with the board again, I will probably take some more video of maniac and god mode for everyone.

Glad to see this sparked some conversation! :)

Offline emphatic

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #51 on: March 15, 2011, 02:31:49 PM »
Why does the title screen still say SALE BY AMI?

Offline ookitarepanda

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #52 on: March 15, 2011, 02:46:55 PM »
Good question. The box that it came in didn't have AMI on it. Maybe they had to give credit to AMI for the original Black Label ver?

Offline brentsg

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #53 on: March 15, 2011, 03:00:41 PM »
They just neglected to remove the AMI.  This was definitely released post-AMI.

The game is shipped in the same box as DFK BL and Akai Katana.

Offline TonK

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #54 on: March 15, 2011, 05:25:00 PM »
I don't want to read, but what version is the port?

I had a much easier time scoring and clearing on the port than I did on the first version of the BL PCB.


Offline EOJ

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #55 on: March 15, 2011, 05:27:29 PM »
Port is the original PCB version, not this "Another ver". It has a bit more slowdown in some spots, which may be why you found it easier to clear.

As for this international version, Cave did this before with Pink Sweets 2006/xx/xx ver - it was sold only through exporters, and features some tweaks that were implemented for reasons unknown.

And let's not forget the earlier international or US versions of some Cave games, which had differences in difficulty compared to the original JP versions.
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Offline zlk

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #56 on: March 15, 2011, 09:35:39 PM »
The US version of donpachi is easier than the JP version.  The medium enemies have fewer hit points and the bombs are completely re-stocked between levels.  The HK version is much harder.  The asian version of progear is harder than the JP version iirc.

Offline Tesuman

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #57 on: March 19, 2011, 07:14:46 AM »
Maybe the Try Tower?  After all, they did get DOJ Soul in there...

Offline ookitarepanda

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #58 on: March 21, 2011, 06:56:31 PM »
Random update, my friend brought over his board again.

We increased the rank from rank 2 (normal) to rank 4 (very hard) and the game is the exact same. We both just put in a few credits on rank 4 and there's no visible differences. And the bosses have the same hit points as well; they pop at the same place as in my videos I posted earlier.

Tried out some maniac and god mode, but we aren't too proficient with either on the later levels so it's hard to gauge the differences there.

Offline EOJ

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Re: Mushihimesama Futari Black Label "ANOTHER VERSION"[Cave 2009, PCB]
« Reply #59 on: May 04, 2018, 10:12:34 PM »
I've read that God mode is identical on this PCB, as compared to the Japanese MFBL. However, I found this stream from Mikado arcade:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldbz2buhdRo

Look at the high score at the top middle of the screen, it is 9,153,753,929. Could a change in the dip settings, such as the extend settings and live stock, account for such a huge increase over the WR scores of the regular MFBL (which are 2 billion less than this)? Or might Spirtual Larsa have a larger end bonus in this version?

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