Author Topic: Retail discs vs XBLA: profitability and personal preference [don't blame gsl]  (Read 4795 times)

Offline THE

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Maniac Member
  • *
  • Posts: 58
Why 1600MS pts? Both Ikaruga and Triggerheart are sold for 800MS pts, while R-type Dimensions is 1200. I don't think Cave would go higher than 1200MS pts. There are only a few games priced at 1600 and they are mainly adventure games.

For Ikaruga it was the third retail release (DC->GC->XBLA) and Triggerheard is a basically a commercial Doujin therefore you can't compare it to Cave situation. If Cave would release DFK directly for XBLA, they would loose to much money compared to releasing it first on disc.

Quote
I would think that retail distro would have more overhead simply because of the cost of printing and distributing physical media though...

Printing a DVD cost around 2-3 USD if you press around 20K. A CD is even less. The physical distribution/license in Cave's case (being both developer and publisher) costs around 30-40% (depends strongly on distribution model) of the retail price. Margins for the retailers are quite low, with the exception of Amazon and other very large retailers.
The future is 2D

Offline Monouchi

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Ultra Member
  • *
  • Posts: 526
Re: Retail discs vs XBLA: profitability and personal preference
« Reply #31 on: February 20, 2010, 03:31:55 AM »
I hate downloadable games and I am so thankful we are getting these games in proper disc packages. Call me old-school but I like having a disc, case, and instruction manual. 

Amen to this.

Offline HVL

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Ultra Member
  • *
  • Posts: 517
I think it's pretty safe to say that there won't be shitty downloadable versions of CAVE's recent titles, and that's good. Fuck DLC.

Offline bcass

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Maniac Member
  • *
  • Posts: 318
    • Project AY
I said it sold a lot. I don't know the lifetime figures, but it sold 22.5K in the first 3 days. I consider that "a lot" for a STG. Triggerheart didn't sell anywhere near that, though (only 7500 downloads in its first week, and keep in mind 40% of those downloads were in Japan). It apparently sold so badly in the US that they took it down from the marketplace in the past year.

One figure I've heard been bandied about for XBLA Ikaruga is approx. 100K.  Also, Triggerheart isn't actually that great (I didn't like it at all) so no wonder that game didn't sell very well.  I don't think there have been enough quality shmups released on the service to ascertain if the platform is a good match for the genre.  I do know that people are much more likely to make an impulse purchase on something that's 1200MSP than something that's $80/$100.

I never said I knew how much they're making, but it's 1200MS points for something that could have been right on the disc. Heaps of extra money for them, even if they only sell a few thousand downloads.

Sure, but what if they only sold a few hundred?  My guess is that the DLC sales aren't that hot, which would explain the reduced emphasis on DLC in the coming releases.  It's all very well saying that it's extra revenue, but it's also extra development time, testing, certification, etc.  All of which costs them money, and without any figures, we'll never know if it's actually been profitable for them.

Offline bcass

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Maniac Member
  • *
  • Posts: 318
    • Project AY
I think it's pretty safe to say that there won't be shitty downloadable versions of CAVE's recent titles, and that's good.

Except there are already DLC-only versions of Caves recent games  :rolleyes:

Offline HVL

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Ultra Member
  • *
  • Posts: 517
I think it's pretty safe to say that there won't be shitty downloadable versions of CAVE's recent titles, and that's good.

Except there are already DLC-only versions of Caves recent games  :rolleyes:

Yes, of which 50% is totally messed up. I was talking about standalone titles, e.g. DFK coming to XBLA instead of retail.

Offline bcass

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Maniac Member
  • *
  • Posts: 318
    • Project AY
Yes, of which 50% is totally messed up.

Who knows, maybe they'll fix that, what with more DLC coming for DeathSmiles.  One of the many benefits of a download service.  The Japanese seem to be embracing the DLC concept even more than the Western devs, so I think it's here to stay.

Karl

  • Guest
  • Trade Count: (0)
The amount they're starting to put into these ports is getting increasingly substantial. Galuda II with two new modes by Ikeda and Yagawa? Yes, please. I just don't see Cave making something with that much just for an XBLA release at $15-$20. If they did make more modes as DLC or something, it would obviously not sell as much as the original release and it would have to cost less than the original in order to make it justifiable in people's minds. I just wonder if the motivation to do the same amount of content would be there.

Offline EOJ

  • Administrator
  • Trade Count: (+37)
  • Ultra Member
  • *
  • Posts: 7498

Sure, but what if they only sold a few hundred?  

Have you ever looked at the leaderboards? There are over 1700 entries in BL's 360 mode Original, with 700+ in Maniac and 800+ in God (obviously most of the users overlap in these modes, and not everyone who bought it submits scores to the leaderboards). So "a few hundred" is impossible. The aforementioned a "few thousand" looks to be more realistic. As I said, it's heaps of extra money for something that could have just been on the disc. The development time for BL was less than 2 months.
My score archive
twitter: cavexstg
XBL gamertag: eojx9999

Offline bcass

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Maniac Member
  • *
  • Posts: 318
    • Project AY
Don't forget that multiple accounts on the same console can submit scores (five people use my console, for example).  It could easily be much closer to 1000.  Not that hot IMO.

Offline EOJ

  • Administrator
  • Trade Count: (+37)
  • Ultra Member
  • *
  • Posts: 7498
Actually, I think it's more likely that it's one console that 1700 people use. That's still $15 more in Cave's pocket than if they put BL on the disc in the first place.
My score archive
twitter: cavexstg
XBL gamertag: eojx9999

Offline bcass

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Maniac Member
  • *
  • Posts: 318
    • Project AY
Not really.  That $15 hardly covers the cost of certification and testing required for DLC. 

And yes, I know you weren't being serious...

Offline EOJ

  • Administrator
  • Trade Count: (+37)
  • Ultra Member
  • *
  • Posts: 7498
I wish you weren't being serious!
My score archive
twitter: cavexstg
XBL gamertag: eojx9999

Offline zakk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Maniac Member
  • *
  • Posts: 102
Don't forget that multiple accounts on the same console can submit scores (five people use my console, for example).  It could easily be much closer to 1000.  Not that hot IMO.

I am amazed at the bizarre uses of anecdotal evidence some of you come up with to justify things in your head.

Offline bcass

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Maniac Member
  • *
  • Posts: 318
    • Project AY
Multiple accounts being used on a single 360 is actually really common.  Also, a lot of cheapskates create multiple accounts in order to get the free 1 month Gold subs.  You get 3 free Gold subs per country.  There are 26 countries that are supported by Xbox Live.  That equates to 78 potential gamertags per 360 (and 78 months of free Gold subs).

The numbers issue is a pertinent point though - if they only sold approx. 1000, does that even cover the costs of admin, certification and testing after Microsoft's cut from each sale?
« Last Edit: February 21, 2010, 06:28:16 PM by bcass »

Offline EOJ

  • Administrator
  • Trade Count: (+37)
  • Ultra Member
  • *
  • Posts: 7498
I can't take any more of this ridiculousness. Thread locked for the betterment of all humanity!
My score archive
twitter: cavexstg
XBL gamertag: eojx9999