Mushihimesama Futari v1.0 - demo mode bug?

[Joe]

Hello, hopefully someone can shed some light on this strange error I might have.  I bought a MF v.1.0 PCB recently and when the game boots the score screen ('Todays original ranking' screen, when scores fly in from the right) seems to cycle and it never goes into demo mode.  The green background continues to scroll but the 4th and 5th scores just fly in, disappear and do it again on a loop - it never moves to display the title screen.  If I turn off free-play and it does this until I put in a coin and then it moves to the title screen.

Also noted, it does not display the Cave/AMI logo when booting - it just goes straight into this score screen loop. 

I can start and play the game fine but this is rather odd.

Has anyone else experienced this or heard of such a bug? Thanks

[kibo]

Hi,

what is the serial number of your pcb?  is ultra mode unlocked?  i have never seen this bug on my pcb but i will do some testing to see if i get the same!

Can you make a video?  if you can't upload it, you can send it to me by e-mail

[Joe]

Hi,

what is the serial number of your pcb?  is ultra mode unlocked?  i have never seen this bug on my pcb but i will do some testing to see if i get the same!

Can you make a video?  if you can't upload it, you can send it to me by e-mail

Thanks Kibo.  Appreciate your reply and offer of help.   The serial number is CA71007. 

Ultra mode is unlocked.  It is "MASTER VER." (One period)

I am going to replace the battery later tonight to see if that helps (maybe the PCB is trying to look for some data that relied on the battery?). 

Thanks

[EOJ]

It's not a bug. It's something wrong with the PCB.

Are there any signs the PCB has been repaired? Looks closely at all the surface-mount chips. Any errors in the EEPROM in the boot-up screen?

I saw a DFK 1.5 PCB in an arcade in Japan recently that did the same thing where it would just keep scrolling in the high scores over and over. Definitely not normal behavior. Mushihimesama PCBs that have been repaired also exhibit strange behavior outside of the game mode.

Changing the battery won't do anything for this, I'm sorry to say.

Another possibility is someone took a Futari 1.5 or Pink Sweets PCB and flashed it with a Futari 1.0 ROM, but something got messed up in the process.

[kibo]

with the serial number i dont think it is a reprogrammed dfk.  However, a repair cannot be ruled out!

Right now, we are seeing some Futari 1.0 resurface!  do you have the path of your pcb?  are you the first owner?

[EOJ]

with the serial number i dont think it is a reprogrammed dfk. 

Certainly not DFK. DFK doesn’t have the battery either.

Like I said, if it was reprogrammed the original pcb was probably futari 1.5 or pink sweets.

[kibo]

I meant pink sweet!  I was wrong in writing because I thought that for some time now we have seen more futari 1.0 than dfk 1.0.

I think more of a futari 1.5

[Joe]

That's a shame.  A rather expensive shame I ordered it off Suruga.com in Japan, and it arrived today, but I do not know the history of the board.  I can't figure out how to post pictures on this site but the board is in very good condition and does not have any repair marks or signs of resoldering.   I'm somewhat of a perfectionist so this is definitely going to bug me (no pun intended). 

Btw - I just tried with a different battery and still the same error. 

I have emailed suruga to let them know, so fingers crossed. 

[Joe]

EOJ - thanks.  On the EEPROM check screen it does not show any errors but stops at 01FA and then boots to the version screen.  After 01FA it does not say "OK" like on the memory check screen, but this might not mean anything.  I have just emailed Kibo a video of this and the error.  Happy to forward to you too if you let me know your email.  Thanks

[kibo]

I noticed a difference with my version.

Joe have : Master ver.

I have : Master ver ( without point, first run ?)

[EOJ]

@kibo, there are three MASTER VERs: no dots, one dot, and two dots.

@Joe: go into the test menu, and look at the high scores that are saved. Is it saving scores properly? Do any scores look strange (weird symbols, etc)? First I would reset/initialize any saved scores on the board. Then, I would try and play some runs and get some scores above the default. Then I'd power down and go into the test menu to see if they are saved there.

I suspect the problem with the DFK 1.5 board I saw in an arcade in Japan is that the EEPROM for saving scores got corrupted. So, I wonder if that is what happened with this Futari 1.0, since it exhibits the same symptom.

[Joe]

@kibo, there are three MASTER VERs: no dots, one dot, and two dots.

@Joe: go into the test menu, and look at the high scores that are saved. Is it saving scores properly? Do any scores look strange (weird symbols, etc)? First I would reset/initialize any saved scores on the board. Then, I would try and play some runs and get some scores above the default. Then I'd power down and go into the test menu to see if they are saved there.

I suspect the problem with the DFK 1.5 board I saw in an arcade in Japan is that the EEPROM for saving scores got corrupted. So, I wonder if that is what happened with this Futari 1.0, since it exhibits the same symptom.

Thanks EOJ - I thought the same about something being corrupted on the scores as the bug looks like it is trying to find something on a score table but cannot, so loops.  Looked a bit like a 'glitch in the matrix' on screen - it first I was going to get my wife to fire bullets at me to see if I can dodge them, but your plan sounds better

I have packed the PCB away but recall the scores in the test menu table looked real/saved from previous players, without any strange characters.   Is resetting/reinitialising the scores something I can do within the test menu?

Thanks!

[EOJ]

Yes, it is easy to reset the scores in the test menu. Just follow the directions provided on the high score ranking page.

[kibo]

Thanks EOJ, Are there any known differences for the 3 master version?

[EOJ]

The main difference is you cannot unlock Ultra (with the code) on the two-dot version.

[Joe]

Yes, it is easy to reset the scores in the test menu. Just follow the directions provided on the high score ranking page.

Thanks EOJ - I have just tried, but to no avail, unfortunately.  I did reset the high scores and I got to exceed one of the scores myself, but the error persists.  The score screen that loops does show the rest scores (just for 4th and 5th place) so it is reading the table, but loops before it shows 3rd and above.  The game still starts and plays fine though.  If it was not so expensive and somewhat of a collector's item I could live with it, but as it stands, it's a lot to pay for something with a fault, even if it's minor in the grand scheme of things.  As you say, could just be the EEPROM got a little corrupted over time and messed with how it reads the score on this demo routine (interestingly the EEPROM check throws up no errors - but watching a counter tick over is the limits of my technical prowess, however).  Still, just another bump in the rocky road of our hobby, preserving old arcade hardware

[rtw]

Yes, it is easy to reset the scores in the test menu. Just follow the directions provided on the high score ranking page.

When you say reset the scores do you mean the: 10.  DEFAULT in the TEST MENU ?

I would recommend doing a complete reset like the one I describe here:

https://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?p=746448#p746448

[Joe]

Yes, it is easy to reset the scores in the test menu. Just follow the directions provided on the high score ranking page.

When you say reset the scores do you mean the: 10.  DEFAULT in the TEST MENU ?

I would recommend doing a complete reset like the one I describe here:

https://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?p=746448#p746448

RTW - thank you very much for the reply.  I did reset default settings on this menu, but also in the game data/ranking menu (pressing 1 Player and button 3 allows scores to be reset), but neither corrected the issue.  Thanks for the link to the reinitialising of the EEPROM. I won't try this as I don't want to risk damaging anything as I've have already started the refund process on the board (TBC) so want to leave everything the same as I received it.   

[rtw]

RTW - thank you very much for the reply.  I did reset default settings on this menu, but also in the game data/ranking menu (pressing 1 Player and button 3 allows scores to be reset), but neither corrected the issue.  Thanks for the link to the reinitialising of the EEPROM. I won't try this as I don't want to risk damaging anything as I've have already started the refund process on the board (TBC) so want to leave everything the same as I received it.

I understand that part, however bear in mind that this is a super rare version.

If you have a friend with some electronic skills this is not a difficult task. If you mask out the pins using tape and a resistor to ground you should be able to do the reset easily.

[rtw]

Actually you do not need to use the resistor trick, I was looking in cv1k.cpp and found the following.

During boot hold P1 Right+A+B+C and P2 Left+A+B+C - Forcibly initialise non-volatile data (EEPROM or NAND settings area)

So use a rubber band on your joysticks hold down the buttons when the game is booting! This is a very easy thing to try

[Joe]

Actually you do not need to use the resistor trick, I was looking in cv1k.cpp and found the following.

During boot hold P1 Right+A+B+C and P2 Left+A+B+C - Forcibly initialise non-volatile data (EEPROM or NAND settings area)

So use a rubber band on your joysticks hold down the buttons when the game is booting! This is a very easy thing to try

Thanks RTW! A good discovery.  Just one question.  Hypothetically if this works, what is the likelihood of such an error recurring.  In other words, does the current issue imply the board's memory is bad and thus more likely to happen in the future.  I am not knowledgeable on such matters so would like any views.   The reason being is that of it works for a while, but then goes bad in the future, I will have lost the option to return it.  Second thought is if it works I would need to re-enable ultra mode, but on the one dot version like this, it seems easy with the code.  Thanks

[rtw]

If this works it will most likely continue to work.

My guess is that there is a race condition in the save code which can lead to corruption in some circumstances. We know from past experience that CAVE have issues with their hi-score code

[Joe]

Actually you do not need to use the resistor trick, I was looking in cv1k.cpp and found the following.

During boot hold P1 Right+A+B+C and P2 Left+A+B+C - Forcibly initialise non-volatile data (EEPROM or NAND settings area)

So use a rubber band on your joysticks hold down the buttons when the game is booting! This is a very easy thing to try

RTW - you are a genius! It worked! Instant resolution and the demo mode starts correctly, and scores are recorded correctly.  A very elegant solution.  Moreover, ultra mode was still enabled after the reinitialise this way.   Thank you very much for your help.  Hopefully you will have also helped others who experience similar problems.  As you said, it's a fairly rare board so nice not to have to send it back if any of you on this thread are over in Tokyo once covid settles down, let me know and I will get you a well earned drink.

[emphatic]

RTW - you are a genius!

Welcome to the RTW fanclub. 

Very happy for you it worked, congrats!

[rtw]

RTW - you are a genius! It worked! Instant resolution and the demo mode starts correctly, and scores are recorded correctly.  A very elegant solution.  Moreover, ultra mode was still enabled after the reinitialise this way.   Thank you very much for your help.  Hopefully you will have also helped others who experience similar problems.  As you said, it's a fairly rare board so nice not to have to send it back if any of you on this thread are over in Tokyo once covid settles down, let me know and I will get you a well earned drink.

Brilliant, glad it worked for you, enjoy your new initialized game

[kibo]

Good news !
it's nice to see that the community goes out of its way to help a fan like us all

[EOJ]

As usual when it comes to these issues, it's rtw to the rescue! Fantastic job. 

[el_rika]

I watched this story biting my nails. Gotta love a happy ending