Do most people who play Cave games play for score?

[bcass]

Do most people who play Cave games even play for score?  I know I don't.  Just completing the games represents a significant challenge for most people.

[EOJ]

Do most people who play Cave games even play for score?  I know I don't. 

That's a bannable offense 'round these parts!

If you don't find it exciting to improve your score in these games, get a new hobby. I suggest knitting.

[Plasmo]

Playing shooters and not trying to score is like driving a car and not knowing where to go.

It could be fun, but actually it's a waste of time.

[bcass]

Nonsense.  Most people over the age of 30 don't have the time to be chasing scores.  The challenge of the game itself provides ample entertainment.

[hermosaguy]

I could tape down the 1P button and shot button and finish any Cave game, which I really wouldnt feel a sense of accomplishment.  Granted not always playing for the WR scores, but personal bests are the only reason I fire these things up.

[bcass]

Yeah, and my guess is that you have a hell of a lot more time to play games than those of us with real responsibilities like kids, wife, full-time job, mortgage, etc.

Bully for you if you can blast through all of Caves games with ease and want to chase scores, but there are plenty (most likely most of their fanbase) who don't have the time to do much more than play just for the actual challenge.

[hermosaguy]

Yeah, and my guess is that you have a hell of a lot more time to play games than those of us with real responsibilities like kids, wife, full-time job, mortgage, etc.

Bully for you if you can blast through all of Caves games with ease and want to chase scores, but there are plenty (most likely most of their fanbase) who don't have the time to do much more than play just for the actual challenge.

Yeah dude, no real world responsibilities at all!  Just playing this little violin over here.  I think I'd consider playing for personal best playing for the actual challenge.  Not trying to break any records obviously, but always trying to beat my previous best. 

[brentsg]

I can see where bcass is coming from though I guess it's OT for this thread.

I can't honestly say that I know how much time time someone like EOJ needs to put into a shmup to achieve the kind of scores that he does.  I'd actually love to know how much time he put into IBL...

But I can say that I have a hard time picturing myself doing much more than juuuusssst barely getting onto most of the high score boards here or at Shmups with the time I have available.  The biggest problem that I personally have is that when I'm chasing score, I need to be awake and sober.  When I do have time it's usually midnight or something.   

I do definitely believe in chasing high scores, at least from the perspective of playing "right".  I think that the various scoring mechanisms (esp for Cave and Raizing) push you toward a certain playstyle for each game.  I just have to keep in mind my skills, family, work, advanced age , and various other gaming handicaps when I look at my scores with pride.   

[EOJ]

I can see where bcass is coming from though I guess it's OT for this thread.

I was referring to personal bests, as hermosaguy mentioned. You should strive to improve your own score, you don't have to compare it to anyone else's, and of course few people really need to concern themselves with 'World Records'. If you're just mindlessly blasting through the game each time never looking at the score or trying out the scoring system then I find it hard to see the point in playing these games for any extended period of time. I certainly wouldn't play them if they didn't have the deep and fun scoring systems that they do.

I can't honestly say that I know how much time time someone like EOJ needs to put into a shmup to achieve the kind of scores that he does.  I'd actually love to know how much time he put into IBL...

I didn't put that much time into IBL really, and in general I don't play games more than a few hours a week (I don't have time for more than that). It's not so much about putting time into the games as it is making the most of the time you spend playing the games. Thus, don't mindlessly blast through the stages - spend the little time it requires to figure out the scoring system and think of new techniques and try them out on each run.

I have all the 'real world' crap to deal with that everyone else does, if not more so. Cave games are my way of unwinding, and getting a new personal best is always a nice feeling. Hobbies should give you some satisfaction, after all.

As for the original question 'do most Cave plans play for score', the answer is of course "YES". Most of their fans are in Japan, and just about everyone here plays for a new 'personal best'. So not having the pros put the game's scoring system through the ringer in the arcades is much like releasing a fighting game straight to console. I.e. it's not going to be that great.

[bcass]

I do understand a lot of the scoring systems (not all), but I wouldn't call being able to get through a Cave game without getting a good score "mindless blasting".  At least not for those of us with very limited gaming-time each week.  There's plenty of dexterity required just learning/dodging the bullet patterns.

[EOJ]

I never said it had to be a 'good score'.

[bcass]

Well, I meant a focus on score, as opposed to focussing on completing the game.  I'd hazard a guess that most people who buy Cave (retail) games never complete them.

[EOJ]

Topic split.

[adverse]

As much as I play games for score and to a certain extent, competition, I have to say that if I don't take a game that I really like to the absolute limit, I feel like I haven't even seen it in its true glory.  For instance, I can watch a superplay of Ibara or something, but until I can do something like that myself, it doesn't have any meaning for me.  It's like going to a museum and seeing a bunch of beautiful paintings and being indifferent until you actually touch the canvas and try your own hand.  That's why a game which I consider an absolute classic like Mushi Futari BL will not end anywhere in the foreseeable future for me since there's still so much further I can go in the game, so much more of the canvas I can use, so many more explosions of gold gems to be had.



Sort of a cheesy answer but it's honestly why I can't put these games down. 

[Joe T.]

What if a sea monster ate your ice cream?

[bucklemyshoe]

I can see where bcass is coming from though I guess it's OT for this thread.

I can't honestly say that I know how much time time someone like EOJ needs to put into a shmup to achieve the kind of scores that he does.  I'd actually love to know how much time he put into IBL...

But I can say that I have a hard time picturing myself doing much more than juuuusssst barely getting onto most of the high score boards here or at Shmups with the time I have available.  The biggest problem that I personally have is that when I'm chasing score, I need to be awake and sober.  When I do have time it's usually midnight or something.   

I do definitely believe in chasing high scores, at least from the perspective of playing "right".  I think that the various scoring mechanisms (esp for Cave and Raizing) push you toward a certain playstyle for each game.  I just have to keep in mind my skills, family, work, advanced age , and various other gaming handicaps when I look at my scores with pride.   

I think you need to just find a game you really love. I'm one of the few people who play for survival. I suck bad, especially now that I don't have an arcade stick but I do have a few games I really want to put the effort into ...but for now just trying to get a 1cc.

[Megalixir]

Or you could just play for you know, fun.

[adverse]

Or you could just play for you know, fun.

A little ironic coming from a guy with 1000/1000 in Otomedius. 

[SuperPang]

I have the attention span of a goldfish and don't put nearly enough hours in to get a reasonable score so how I play depends on the game. For example I have fun playing DOJ for survival as its hard as nails and the scoring is so strict, where as with Deathsmiles I can grab a 1CC and get a lot out of the very flexible scoring system as well without putting RPG like hours of commitment into learning the game.

[kernow]

Agreed, DOJ scoring is anything but fun.

[AKraten]

Agreed, DOJ scoring is anything but fun.

[zlk]

I play just to finish the game on one credit.  If I really like the game, I might worry about score.  Finishing most cave games on one credit is difficult enough for me. 

[skykid]

I used to think the 1cc was all I wanted in a Cave game, but once I get wind of a scoring system, score comes along for the ride whether I like it or not. I compulsively can't ignore scoring opportunities once I know they're present - and why would I, they're half the fun.

I've found scoring slows down getting the clear by about half (I die loads trying to figure out ways to maximise stages, whereas my initial few credits are always pretty lengthy) but in the end I wouldn't have it any other way.

But I'm with Pang and Kernow on DOJ - that one is strictly survival for the most part. I don't even have time to think about score.

[antares]

I think with shmups it's the same as with every other gaming genre. Most people who buy them play them casually and the "hardcore" fans are in the minority. Like with racing games, most people will play through the main mode and race a few online races, but real racing fans will try to improve lap times and practice every track dozens of times; with RPGs most people will just play them and the real fans will try to find every secret and every item; with fps fans will try to beat them on hardest difficulty level and so on. It's the same with shmups, most people will just play them, creditfeed through the end, maybe try a few times to get far on one credit.
You just need to look in online leaderboards or hiscore threads on forums to prove this. For example Deathsmiles sold like 50,000 on the XBox but in the leaderboards maybe the top 200 players are having half decent scores. And the gaming industry needs to be that way to economical survive. Imagine only the hardcore fans would buy ports of shmups, then games like DS would have sold 1,000 pieces and Cave would soon be out of the market.

[bcass]

creditfeed through the end

That is definitely not what I am advocating here.

[brentsg]

For example Deathsmiles sold like 50,000 on the XBox but in the leaderboards maybe the top 200 players are having half decent scores.

I think this is awesome though.  Even if you're not a uber player it's fun to see your score posted and to continue to work on beating your personal bests.  I really enjoy my PCBs that save high scores so being able to post them automatically to a worldwide board is even better on Xbox live. 

Really it would be cool to have more casual-friendly high-score threads on these kind of forums, because even if you aren't competing for top 10 or 20, whatever..  it's still awesome to have that additional competitive element.

[fuse]

To ask a question like this does seem a little troll-worthy but I do appreciate the OP is being entirely sincere - I am under 30 but I can promise you that I have plenty of 'real' responsibilities like anyone else here. I do not consider myself up there in terms of skill with a lot of the guys here, but even still I enjoy the challenge of increasing my own score; if I can find other people about the same skill level to compete with, that's a good result.

When you've got a game so intricately designed for scoring, to me it makes sense that scoring is just as important a measure of your skill at the game as survival. If you're not actually employing any specific scoring techniques then in many games your score is essentially going to be a reflection of how far you've made it, but by learning the scoring system you can often make things easier for yourself in the long run, and certainly get a lot more satisfaction out of a game. I'm not going to say that I've never focused purely on survival, or never not liked a scoring system, but to completely ignore that aspect is a bit short-sighted in my mind.

[NR777]

Speaking as someone who hasn't even 1cc'd one of these yet, I still play for score because I find I actually get much more out of the game this way.  I'm just starting to get the hang of Progear's scoring system and I now find that game a lot more fun than I did originally.  Overall, I think players are cheating themselves out of most of the depth in these games if they leave the scoring system untouched in favor of just going for the clear. 

[bcass]

Ignoring intricate scoring mechanisms is also something which I am not advocating.

[Lunchbox]

I started to chase scores (or trying to "score well" ) just to get the extendeds, wich I need for actually finish the game.
I only 1CC'ed DS and DFKK, both with a Shitty scores and enjoyed trying to improve the score.
As a beginer,I recognice the extra depth of the gameplay if you take a little care of scoring system (at least in the first stages  )

And, yeah, i'm in the middle of crap & bliss of real life.